Practical Preservation Podcast featuring Lauren Dillion of Master of Plaster

Lauren Dillion of Master of Plaster joined the Practical Preservation podcast to discuss:

  • Her introduction to plaster as an art form
  • The different types of plaster (I really didn’t know there were so many) – lime (there are different types of lime!), gypsum, and clay
  • Lauren answered all of my lime wash questions
  • Plus you will hear Lauren’s insights into preservation trends and challenges

It is always enjoyable to speak with someone who is passionate about their work and is as excited about preservation education as we are – I think you will enjoy this episode.

Contact info:

Lauren Dillion, Master of Plaster

Instagram (lots of pretty pictures)  email: design@masterofplaster.com  phone: 1-800-352-5915

Offers:

Bio:

Lauren Dillon is the Executive Designer at Master of Plaster Finishing Systems. Specializing in crafting historically authentic hydrated lime plasters, their materials are used throughout the US and Canada on the restoration of Historic Structures as well as architectural finishes in Residential and Commercial projects. With an emphasis on quality materials, her work focuses on promoting the craft and trade of the plasterer as well as providing education on proper application processes for both preservation work and installations in new design/build projects.

Speaker 1:

Thank you for tuning in to the Practical Preservation podcast. Please take a moment to visit our website practicalpreservationservices.com for additional information and tips to help you restore your historical home. If you’ve not done so, please subscribe to us on iTunes, Stitcher, or SoundCloud, and also like us on Facebook. Welcome to the Practical Preservation podcast, hosted by Danielle and Jonathan Keperling. Keperling Preservation Services is a family owned business based in Lancaster, Pennsylvania, dedicated to the preservation of our built architectural history for today’s use as well as future generations. Our weekly podcast provides you with expert advice specific to the unique needs of renovating a historic home, educating by sharing from the trenches preservation knowledge and our guest’s expertise, balancing modern needs while maintaining the historical significance, character, and beauty of your period home.

Speaker 2:

Lauren Dillion is the executive designer at master of plaster finishing systems, specializing in crafting historically authentic hydrated lime plasters. Their materials are used throughout the U.S. and Canada, on the restoration of historic structures, as well as architectural finishes and residential and commercial projects. With an emphasis on quality materials, her work focuses on promoting the craft and trade of the plasterer as well as providing education on proper application processes for both preservation work and installations in new design build projects.

Danielle:

Today on the practical preservation podcast, we have Lauren Dillion from Master Plaster. Lauren, thank you for joining us today.

Lauren Dillion:

Thanks for having me Danielle.

Danielle:

Yeah, okay, so how did you get started in preservation?

Lauren Dillion:

So my background is a little different. I studied landscape architecture at Virginia Tech, and it’s a very interdisciplinary program as far as from a design school. So we did a lot of architecture classes, industrial design, and landscape architecture. But my fifth year thesis project, I actually focused on Charleston, South Carolina, and worked pretty closely with mayor Riley. And as we all know Charleston’s such a great city to study in as far as from a preservation standpoint. So my studies there led me to doing a masters in urban design with a focus in historic preservation in Dublin, Ireland.

Danielle:

Oh, that sounds amazing.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, and that’s really where I really fell in love with plaster as an artistic form. The Georgian and architecture in Dublin and in Ireland is just really phenomenal. So yeah, so that’s my indirect path into preservation.

Danielle:

And then into plaster. So what drew you into the plaster in Dublin and the Georgian architecture there?

Lauren Dillion:

So my father was a plaster by trade, and I grew up knowing what he did and really appreciating his work, but not really getting my hands dirty or being on-site or truly comprehending what he did. So I would say being in Dublin, I had that appreciation as a craft for the interiors, and their interiors they’re just so ornate. And they also, I tell everyone in the States we don’t really have a great body of work or research on our plasters that have come through before [crosstalk 00:03:47].

Danielle:

But as the actual trades people.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, and the work that was done at different estate or in different structures, and Ireland has a really great body of work. You’re really kind of dating back to the 1600s on their plasters and on the work that was done and the processes and techniques. So I actually had access to really learn and research and study and learn about the trade as more of an art form and a craft, than I really had access over here in the state. So I’d say that was, my time in Ireland was really crucial to mind development within the trade.

Danielle:

That’s amazing. The really smooth Venetian plaster walls, I just want to touch them.

Lauren Dillion:

Yes. They pull you in, they draw you in.

Danielle:

Yes. So I was on your website a little bit yesterday preparing for our interview today, and I saw that you have different products and services, and we do a little bit of plaster. If we mess up a wall, we’ll touch it up, but we’re not anywhere near the type of work that you do. And I’m curious about it. So can you tell me about the work that you do?

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, so we really operate as manufacturers. So we handcraft hydrated lime putty plasters, we have a few different lines that we do a restoration plaster that’s used specifically in preservation projects, but we also do lime washes, which are used in exterior, and then interior finishes. We do a line of the Venetian plaster, so more of that high-end, new design installation work, where people aren’t painting over, then after they’re leaving that raw plaster finish. We do a lot of tinting. So a lot of my work is working directly with architects and designers and individual clients on color creation for their interior spaces. We also do [crosstalk 00:05:42].

Danielle:

Do you tint the plaster?

Lauren Dillion:

We do.

Danielle:

Okay, yeah.

Lauren Dillion:

So a lot of tinting, whether it’s historically accurate and we’re matching what was there originally or recreating new colors for clients. But then we do a lot of constone plaster, which kind of turn of the century, the stone that was quarried out of conference was very popular in the state, and then they shut down that quarry in the 70s. And so this plaster we create really mimics and emulates that Ashlar faced finish. So that material was used in the restoration of Grand Central Station to really try to recreate some original finishes.

Lauren Dillion:

And then we create custom plasters. We did a project in New York where they wanted to give more context to the space. So we actually worked with the design team and added a black river sand, a local black river sand to the plaster. So we like to get creative and we’re not just a standard, these are the products, this is all we offer, but we’re also very hands-on. So we’ll do training and we’ll host people in our warehouse if they want to learn how to work the tools, the Hawk and the travel. I’m so very hands-on I’d say.

Danielle:

Okay, and I have a question about the lime washers, are they for interior and exterior?

Lauren Dillion:

They’re, but they work traditionally as an exterior lime wash in that they’re sacrificial coating and they will wear away over time. That’s where you get that really beautiful age in patina, like in New Orleans and Charleston and Savannah, it’s that layering of the lime wash over the years. It can be used in exterior, but we don’t make any exterior products that don’t need to be maintained over time.

Danielle:

Right. And all products truly do need to be either maintained or replaced.

Lauren Dillion:

Right. That’s a very good point.

Danielle:

And that just made me think, is the lime wash, is it all for masonry then, or can you put it on wood? We’ve never used that.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah.

Danielle:

Okay.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, you can put it on wood, mostly masonry, but then yeah. And then interior installations, there’s some products out there with the lime wash and you can do it over a painted surface, or a sheet of drywall, sheet rock. But our limewash does need to have some kind of plaster substrate to actually soak into and adhere to. So there’s no acrylics or binders, they’re going to make it bind like a painted surface.

Danielle:

Okay. very good. I learned something today. I did see on your website that you do the premixed restoration plaster, which you kind of talked about. How is that different from the gypsum that you could buy at a big box store, the gypsum plaster mixes?

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, so the gypsum is, it comes from gypsum stone, whereas the hydrated lime putties come from limestone, and the limestone is burnt between 1500 and 1700 degrees and all the impurities are burned away. So it gets down to chemistry. Gypsum is only burned about 350 degrees, and a lot of the impurities are left in the stone, so that’s why it’s in a powder state in a bag. And what happens is when you mix the H2O molecules, the water back into it, it goes through a chemical set. So it reacts and you have maybe 25, 30 minutes to work with it.

Danielle:

Right.

Lauren Dillion:

And then it’s going to set up on you, and it’s hard. It’s got a greater tensile strength than a hydrated lime putty plaster, the plasters we create are very traditional, and when we add the H2O molecules back into it, it goes through a process called flaking where the lime is mixing those molecules or mixing with the H2O molecules and actually gets better with age. So it doesn’t go through a chemical set per se. What actually happens is when you apply it to your wall, it’s not just drying out like a clay plaster would do, and it’s not going through that chemical set like a gypsum would, it’s actually reabsorbing carbon dioxide. So when you talk about those Venetian plaster walls, it’s really completing the lime cycle on your surface. So it’s an essence turning back into stone by reabsorbing that CO2 on your walls.

Danielle:

So does it take longer then for it to cure?

Lauren Dillion:

It does. Yes. And that’s a good point as well. So hydrated lime plasters need to be applied in very thin veneer layers, and that’s a lot of where the beauty comes into those materials is that layering process, where as gypsum it actually swells. So limes shrinks as it cures, just a touch and gypsum actually swell as it cures. So gypsum is a thicker, heavier coat application versus the hydrated lime.

Danielle:

That’s very interesting. Thank you.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, it gets pretty complex.

Danielle:

It does, but I never knew the difference, and I never, it just wasn’t even on my radar. And then I’m like, Oh, I had maybe six months ago someone had asked me about it. I’m like, Oh, I need to do some research on this. And so now I know a little bit more, thank you. Also on your website, I noticed that you do a lot of educational outreach and continuing education. Why is that important? And I’m assuming that some of it has to do with the wealth of information you found in Dublin and being able to make a record of what you were doing.

Lauren Dillion:

Yes. And I think it comes down to the complexity of the trade. I think people use plaster as such a broad term and it really, I mean, there’s so many different facets that fall under the term plaster. You’ve got the ornamental plaster, the flat wall, you’ve got clay, you’ve got gypsum, you’ve got hydraulic lime plasters, you’ve got hydrated lime plasters, you’ve got molding plasters. So I think there’s such a wealth of information that not many people access to, and there is quite a bit of misinformation I think out there. So we run across a lot of projects where they’re using joint compound to, and I kind of doing quotes to restore interior plaster. Well, those are bad fixes. They fail over time. And then it gives plaster a bad rep that, okay, this is just a shoddy material and it’s not modern and we need to tear it out.

Lauren Dillion:

So I think the amount of misinformation, and people aren’t doing it, they’re not being negligent, they’re not doing a shoddy restoration on purpose. [crosstalk 00:12:29].

Danielle:

They just don’t know.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, they just don’t know. And there’s really not that great of access to high quality materials on the market anymore. So I think just letting people, the education component is very big for us, because A, it’s going to just help the trade and the craft continue to grow, again in the long term. But then B, just really give people avenues or access to avenues of education and knowledge. And we’re very hands-on with just sharing that knowledge.

Danielle:

And I agree, and we are too. And when you were saying about using drywall compound, in the past few weeks, I saw a video of a preservationist that has a large following on social media, take a bag of plaster, like the gypsum plaster, and a bucket of drywall compound and mix them and tell them that’s how they help people should plaster the walls. I stopped the computer, I ran downstairs, I told my husband you need to watch this. And he’s like, do you think it will work, I said, I don’t know, I’ve never seen anything like this before.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, and they probably think that what they’re doing is correct, and this is a great way to go about it. And it’s not from ill wish or whatnot, it’s just that’s what people understand nowadays.

Danielle:

Right. Yeah, We were talking about trying it as an experiment.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, [inaudible 00:14:04].

Danielle:

I know you took a roundabout way to get into preservation and into manufacturing more traditional materials, but is there anything that you wish that you knew when you got started that you know now?

Lauren Dillion:

Probably I think for me that you can’t win them all. I get very emotionally invested and we do a lot of consultation, so we’re based in Columbia, South Carolina. For me, there was this project in Greenville that was this beautiful, three-story Italianate, 1800 structure that the community and the Preservation South Carolina worked very hard to save. And then we did a lot of consulting on it about the proper techniques to go and do the interiors and whatnot. And then they hired a guy that just drywall mudded the entire interior. And for me that was heartbreaking. And so I think being young and energetic and excited, and I’m like, Oh, anytime I tell anybody about it, about how the proper ways they’re going to follow it and it’s going to be great. So I think just knowing to get emotionally invested because that’s when you do your best work, but to not get so emotional about the projects that you don’t reach the people and you aren’t able to really help them with their interiors.

Danielle:

Right. Yeah, and the other thing I think is you can’t take it personal. I know that that’s something like, if somebody doesn’t pick me, then I’m like, but it’s not necessarily about me.

Lauren Dillion:

Right. Exactly. I think most preservationists get pretty passionate and pretty emotionally invested. So that’s probably something all of us, especially starting out it’s like, okay, you can’t get just too emotionally involved.

Danielle:

Yeah, do your best work for the people that understand you, and everybody will be happy.

Lauren Dillion:

Right. Exactly.

Danielle:

Yeah, so what’s the biggest challenge that you see in preservation?

Lauren Dillion:

I’d say, especially coming from a plaster perspective, that saving the interiors and not just the exteriors. I think a lot of our law, a lot of our regulations, extend to the exteriors and then when it comes to the interiors, it’s free reign. And you’ve got a lot of those HGTV shows where it’s alright, we’re going to go in and we’re going to get this and we’re going to get rid of the plaster and we’re going to update everything to modern. So I’d say that, I think one of the biggest is how do we educate the broader realm on how to restore and save the interiors.

Lauren Dillion:

And then I would also say, I’d say probably a challenge is a lot of projects are always going with the lowest bidder. And not that that’s a bad thing, but I think on some historic structures, it’s to the detriment of the building, you might not be getting the most certified or the best quality work for that structure. And it’s such a highly specific profession, whether it’s from the carpentry or the stonework or the masonry or the plaster that sometimes it’s going to benefit the overall project to go with a higher price. But a lot of projects tend to lean more towards the lowest bidder. But I think those are too big[Crosstalk 00:17:35]

Danielle:

And especially with the government projects, I’ve noticed that they’ll go with the lowest bidder and it’s not necessarily the best thing for the building or the longevity of the repairs.

Lauren Dillion:

Yes, that’s absolutely correct.

Danielle:

Yeah, what trends do you see in preservation?

Lauren Dillion:

I think preservation is somewhat trendy now, which is really exciting. And the adaptive reuse is definitely, I think more, it’s coming into the broader vernacular for a lot of designers and architects, but I would also say historic authenticity. I think people are starting to pay attention to materials and are we maintaining the historical authenticity, not just from a design standpoint, architectural elements, but also from a material standpoint, with that that’s exciting to really see. So I think more architects, more designers, more homeowners, or owners of these different structures are really starting to invest more and learning about materials, and how those different materials impact the space or how they will impact, like you said earlier, the longevity of that structure.

Danielle:

Yeah, and I think the internet does help all of that because you can go online and sometimes you’ll get misinformation, but there is a lot of good information out there and you can at least know more, you can at least have a base [crosstalk 00:19:02]

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, or you can find the people that you feel like are going to be willing to take the time to communicate what they know.

Danielle:

Yes. So is there anything that you want to highlight that makes Master Plaster different from other preservation businesses or other manufacturers? You could answer that however you’d like.

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah. I think we’re a little bit different in that we are, so it’s a family run business and we’re all craftsmen. So we’re not just selling a product, we don’t have distributors set up around the country, we don’t sell online. We want to have a conversation with our clients first, so whether it’s they’re emailing us or they’re calling us, and we want to know what their goal is, what they’re trying to achieve, and how our materials might be right for the project or maybe they need to go with the gypsum or maybe they need to go with a clay product. And so, yeah. So I think maybe just we operate a little bit differently in that we’re very hands-on and get pretty heavily involved with our clients, which I think some really appreciate, and then others are probably kind of like, all right, I’m going to go do this, I’m going to do this myself and figure it out. [crosstalk 00:20:18] I’m emailing, and I’m like, so what’s going on, please give me an update.

Danielle:

I want to see pictures.

Lauren Dillion:

I want to see pictures. Exactly. So I’d say yeah, I think that’s how we operate a little differently.

Danielle:

Okay, so how can our listeners contact you?

Lauren Dillion:

Email is great, as well as phone calls. Our Instagram account shows a lot of process photos and a lot of images of the materials installed and visually, you know what a visual medium plaster is a lot of times.

Danielle:

Yes.

Lauren Dillion:

The Instagram accounts is such a great introduction to the materials and the processes. So that helps a ton. But yeah, they’re just phone calls and emails are wonderful, especially, I get pretty involved with emails as far as, I think they become a nice resource for people to always refer back to during their restoration project, because they have the bullet points in hand and they can follow and reference. So either way is great.

Danielle:

Okay, very good. Well, I will make sure that your email, the phone calls, your website and your Instagram is on the website where I post the interview.

Lauren Dillion:

Okay.

Danielle:

So people will be able to find you easily. Are you going to be presented anywhere, do you have samples, anything you want to share or an offer for the listeners?

Lauren Dillion:

Yeah, I send out sample sets all the time. We love sending out sample sets, it’s such a tactile material, but it’s nice for people to really see and feel the hydrated lime putty plasters, and the finishes aesthetics. So if anyone’s interested in seeing the materials, happy to put together a sample set and send those out. We will be in Miami, in November at the APT Annual Conference, the association of preservation technology that the community that we’re pretty heavily involved with, and they do great research and analysis, then the annual conference is always a wonder gathering of different preservationists. And then we do, we offer onsite trainings here in Columbia at our warehouse, or then it’s a project where we need to travel and do onsite trainings directly with applicators or architects, we’re always happy to do that as well.

Danielle:

Okay. Well, very good. I’ll make sure all of that information is on the website also. Thank you so much for coming on today. And as soon as I have everything edited and posted, I will get it up on the site and I’ll send you the link.

Lauren Dillion:

Okay, yeah. No, that sounds great.

Danielle:

Okay, thank you very much.

Lauren Dillion:

Thanks Danielle.

Speaker 1:

Thanks for listening to the Practical Preservation podcast. The resources discussed during this episode are on our website at practicalpreservationservices.com/podcast. If you received value from this episode and know someone else that will get value from it as well, please share it with them. Join us next week for another episode of the Practical Preservation podcast. For more information on restoring your historic home, visit practicalpreservationservices.com.

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